Press conference - Canberra

ANTHONY ALBANESE, PRIME MINISTER OF AUSTRALIA: Good afternoon, on what is a very historic day for Papua New Guinea and for Australia. Last month I had the enormous privilege and the absolute pleasure of representing the people of Australia in Port Moresby at what were quite spectacular celebrations to mark the 50th anniversary of Papua New Guinea's independence. I'm delighted to be able to return that hospitality and welcome my friend, Prime Minister Marape, back to Australia once again. We both enjoyed the football game last night, the NRL Grand Final. And congratulations to the Brisbane Broncos.

Last month, we commemorated a historic anniversary and we celebrated our shared past. Today, with the signing of the Pukpuk Treaty, the Papua New Guinea-Australia Mutual Defence Treaty. We commit ourselves to securing and shaping our future together. Fifty years ago, Prime Minister Gough Whitlam hailed Sir Michael Somare's vision for independence as, to quote him, "an idea whose time had come." When Prime Minister Marape first came to me for this treaty, I knew that this was an idea whose time had come. This treaty elevates the relationship between our two nations to the status of an alliance. It is Australia's first new alliance in more than 70 years and only the third in our history, along with our alliances with the United States of America and New Zealand. I say on behalf of the Government and the people of Australia, we consider it a great honour that our nearest neighbour is our newest ally. This treaty contains a mutual defence obligation similar to Australia's ANZUS treaty commitments, where we declare that in the event of an armed attack on either of our countries, we would both act to meet the common danger. Both our nations have also agreed not to undertake any activities or enter into any agreements that would compromise the implementation of this treaty. The treaty also reaffirms both countries absolute respect for our neighbours, sovereignty, independence and territorial integrity.

Our mutual defence treaty builds on 50 years of cooperation and friendship between our nations. This alliance of equals reflects our common commitment to a more secure and stable region. Above all, it is founded on the friendship between our peoples. I was honoured greatly to be the first foreign leader to speak to the PNG Parliament, and to return that honour by making sure that Prime Minister Marape was the first Pacific leader to address the Australian Parliament. Our friendship is strong. Prime Minister Marape and I have signed this treaty, but it is our citizens who will make these words a bond. Prime Minister Marape, when we stood together in Port Moresby last month, you said this treaty was about securing not just Australia, not just Papua New Guinea, but, but to quote your words then, "our space in the world map, our space in the Pacific", as you said, others will go where they have to go. But at the end of the day, in this part of the world, it is us that remain here. Today is about the future our nations will shape here, as neighbours, as equals, as mates and now as allies.

Prime Minister, thank you.

JAMES MARAPE, PRIME MINISTER OF PAPUA NEW GUINEA: Thank you very much, Prime Minister Albanese. I want to say it's a privilege to be here on Australia's Labour Day. And I want to apologise for causing yourself and every Australian who is here, in the media and those who work here in Canberra, in the Prime Minister's Office, for you to come out of your barbecues and your Australian events, especially post-NRL for the Rugby League fans. I just want to sincerely apologise.

But what a day to sign this historic moment. A day in which it commemorates Labor and Labor's cause in the construct of Australia. Part of the construct saved the construct of my country to what it is today. And I want to say thank you very much, Prime Minister Albanese. My brother, my friend, you accepted the proposal from our government to enter into this treaty. It is a landmark for our two nations. This treaty was not conceived out of geopolitics or any other reason, but out of geography, history and the enduring reality of our shared neighbourhood. It is about one big fence that secures two houses that has its own yard space. It is in this construct that we are going about in signing this treaty. As it was in the past, there will be tomorrows coming upon us. The past leaves the space we are leaving our present. It is about seeing what happens into the future and constructing an agreement, an alliance, a treaty that shapes and protects and seals that future for those who will call themselves Papua New Guineans and Australians.

As I said in my address to your Parliament and thank you for giving me this extraordinary privilege of my life. I said, since time immemorial, we coexisted. Before there was a country or continental island called Australia as it is today, or an island called New Guinea or Papua New Guinea as it is today, and as far as countries are concerned - there was a continental shelf called the Sahul. In this shelf, we coexisted. We belong to a space in the world that the ancient people, existed here and today. At present, we exist and into time, into the future, our existence will still remain - if Jesus doesn't come back at the earliest. Papua New Guinea was birthed from the womb of Australia, as I addressed the Independence occasion not too long ago. I want to thank the entire Australian leadership, the only person missing was maybe Foreign Minister Penny Wong, because someone's got to be at the House, keeping the House warm. But nonetheless, the entire Canberra was relocated to Wagani, as you joined us in our 50th anniversary of continued democracy and celebration of our country.

I want to say this treaty is just the beginning of the next phase in our two nations' relationship. An umbrella of cooperation that gives shade to our partnership. Defence is core in this conversation, but deep inside it entails police, people-to-people engagements, and as we journey into the future, the umbrella gives shade to all engagements - more, importantly people-to-people, business-to-business, and, of course, government-to-government, that has existed for the last 50 years and going forward. In 2019, I had the distinguished pleasure of signing the Comprehensive Strategic Economic Partnership. That elevated our two nations' relationship from what it was before then, to nations equal in value as far as trade and the government relationship is concerned. Today, we have witnessed the historic signing of the PNG-Australia Mutual Security Treaty, labelled Pukpuk.

And I want to say, this one will secure us. Our society prospers, as the Greeks say, when old men plant trees who shade they shall never sit under. God willing, 50 years from today, me and Albanese live on, my brother Anthony. But we, by the fact that our biological clock is ticking, there's a time in which we will be in demise. But our children will live on. The children of PNG and Australia will live on. Some things that we can never change are history and geography. This is the part of the world where we will be living, our children will be living. And so, it is in this context that for Papua New Guinea, we made a strategic call, a conscious choice that Australia will be our security partner of choice. And that choice - for the life of me, I will never live to regret this choice I made. Nothing to do with rugby league. Nothing to do with any other matters that hangs in the public space, whether geopolitics, et cetera. Purely in the heart and soul of this, PNG and Australia's coexistence, in this part of the world going forward into the future.

And I want to say in closing, in my traditional - in the holy world that I come from, in Papua New Guinea, Melanesia, by the fireplace - it is not strangers that sit by the fireplace all the time. Once in a while, strangers will come into your house to sit by the fireplace. But always, all the time, it is those who are in your neighbourhood and those you share relationship with who will always be by the fireplace. This is a fireplace conversation between PNG in Australia. We are forever stuck in this part of Earth, going into the future, it is important we engage in this. And I want to say thank you to Australia for accepting our proposal to all Papua New Guineans and to Australians. Australia never imposed this on us. A proposal we put to them. Australia accepted and has brought us to this venture in our nation's relationship. Right after stepping out of our 50th anniversary, we thought this is the first reset activity we do, preserving our sovereignty, but securing our space as we coexist going into the future.

Thank you very much, Prime Minister.

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Thank you, Prime Minister. We'll take questions on this and then I'm happy to take some questions on some broader issues.

JOURNALIST: Thanks Prime Minister, and congratulations to you both. If I could ask you both, how would this work in the event of a Bougainville Crisis Mark II? Would it obligate Australia to come to Papua New Guinea's aid in that kind of a circumstance? And if I could ask you, Mr Marape, you have not recognised Palestine. It's a different position obviously to that of Mr Albanese. Is this something you've spoken about and what's your sort of, I guess, justification to Australia on that one?

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Thank you. Firstly on Bougainville, this is a good question. My Parliament knows next year we will be, part of our legislative changes we're doing - we will be bringing legislative change, putting into Part 14 of our Constitution, clarity that Bougainville is a no-military zone for the PNG Defence Force. So, we'll make it absolutely clear, and Bougainville, we'll be labelling it a demilitarised zone, give security that no stepping into Bougainville as far as defence force, or police for that matter. We are encouraging the Bougainville Government to step up their police force as far as dealing with lawlessness is concerned. In this treaty, also it embraces our own - we have two nations, have many sovereign relations with other nations. It doesn't impinge into our different relationships we have with other nations. It protects our own relations with other nations, but it allows us at a meeting point to discuss key strategic military and defence matters also.

JOURNALIST: I'm just wondering, PNG's Opposition Leader has been slightly critical of the pact. I'm just wondering what work has been done to make sure there's bipartisan support within PNG and to make sure that this treaty withstands any change of government?

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Section 206 of our Constitution allows for us to have this sort of military engagements, defence treaties. 1977, we had a Status of Force Agreement with the Australian Defence Force. 2013, we have a Defence Cooperation Agreement with the Australian Defence Force. And this one now elevates from those two agreements to a treaty now, at the highest. This is Australia's only second treaty relationship outside of Australia's relations with New Zealand, the ANZAC relationship. And the USA - they now have this with us. So, it's a privilege for us to have this relationship. We proposed, they accepted it. We will now go through the final leg of this treaty. I will take it back to my Parliament. Prime Minister Albanese takes it to Parliament. Section 117 of our Constitution allows for the ratification process to take foot. We will be transparent, full disclosure to all in PNG and of course, Australia, all in Australia, on what really entails this treaty. And so leaders of our country will be informed and the ratification process will take its course. Parliament will have full disclosure. And the Opposition Leader is most welcome to comment on these matters.

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: I see this very much as lifting our relationship to the next level. It was always, very, very good. But this alliance, as I said, it's a historic moment. The first new alliance from Australia in 70 years. And as the Prime Minister has said, this came from Prime Minister Marape, discussing it firstly with myself and then us as a government, considering the proposal from PNG and agreeing to it, that it was in the interests of both of our countries, of our sovereignty. As the Prime Minister has said, I think the one fence, two houses is a very good statement which sums up what this is about, elevating it. We'll release today the full text of the treaty, we'll be transparent. Both of our Parliaments will go through the processes which are there. But this has been done in a very orderly way and I think it will be very much considered, after the Prime Minister and I have gone, maybe not from this world, but from our respective positions, this will be looked at as something that was very much in the interests of both of our nations and in the interests of the region.

JOURNALIST: Prime Minister, Papua New Guinea is famously friends to all and enemies to none. But why wouldn't Beijing view this agreement as making special friends of Australia and, although not saying it, framing China as the enemy?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Well, this is about our relationship. This is about Australia and Papua New Guinea being good neighbours, the closest of neighbours, now the newest of allies. So, it's about our relationship, recognises as part of it the sovereignty of other nations and is consistent with that.

PRIME MINSTER MARAPE: This is not a treaty that sets up enemies, but consolidates friendships. And China has - we've been transparent. We have told them that Australia has become our security partner of choice and they understand our alliances here. They have relationship elsewhere, including our own relationships. Other aspects of our relationship has never been compromised. Australia has been always a security partner of choice, just consolidating that space with no intent of creating enemies elsewhere.

JOURNALIST: Your speech about the fireplace - do you consider China as someone welcome at that fireplace, or are they one of the strangers that can come in and sit? And Prime Minister Albanese, is this something you'll take to your meeting with President Trump to show as a sign of Australia doing the work on the ground in our region when it comes to shoring up alliances?

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: People come in and go out, but we're here to stay. If you look at our region in the context we're here to stay, you cannot, you cannot just one night take PNG away from the map, in the world map. So, in that context, it is in our shared nation's interest to have this treaty. Others exist with other aspects of our relationship and they're fine with this one. Again, as I said, this has nothing whatsoever to do with geopolitics. Australia still maintains their relations with China and other nations. We still maintain a relationship with China, other nations, especially where its foreign relations are maintained in the context of security treaty, we have this exclusivity.

PRIME MINISTER: This is about our relationship with Papua New Guinea, which is in the context of the work that we've done in our region. I have said Australian foreign policy has three pillars. The alliance with the United States is one of them. Our support for regional engagement, and that is something that we have stepped up unapologetically with the Pacific Island Forum, with our near neighbours, with ASEAN. And the third is our support for multilateralism. They've been the foundations of Australian foreign policy for a long period of time. This is a concrete example of Australia accepting the invitation and the idea from Papua New Guinea that we step up this relationship to an alliance.

JOURNALIST: Prime Minister Marape, you said, I think, a few weeks ago, that your Defence Minister would go to other nations in the region to tell them about the treaty. Is that still your intention for Dr. Joseph to travel? Have you heard anything from Indonesia or from China about any questions or reservations they may have about this document? And Prime Minister Albanese, if I could ask - it's been publicly stated before, there would also be a pathway for Australian citizens to serve in the PNGDF. It's not explicitly referenced in this statement. Can I just clarify that that is still the case under this arrangement?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Yes, it's the case. And as a first step, as part of this agreement, people who are permanent residents in Australia will have the same rights as current members of Five Eyes to serve and participate in the Australian Defence Force. One of the things that the treaty makes very explicit when you are able to examine the words in the treaty, is that it speaks about interoperability. So, that means defence assets, but our greatest asset is our people. And so that means Australians and PNG people - as we always have, as we always have, but at a very different level, being able to step up. When I visited Wewak as part of my first visit to Papua New Guinea, I certainly saw that on the ground. We have such a shared history. This takes it to another level.

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Our Defence Minister will still be doing his visits to other nations that we relate with, and to inform them that we choose to go down this path. And hopefully they will accept our transparency in what we're doing. We will not keep it secret, Australia's engagement with us is in this space. And for PNG, there's also a lot of symbiosis, it, as we work forward into the future PNG citizens who, if we go through the process, they will be enlisted into Australian Defence Force and working under the command of Australian Defence Commander. So, a lot of gain in this treaty going forward. It is in our interest to go to countries that we have secure relationship with, USA, Japan, Indonesia, China and all the other nations we relate with, to explain to them what is happening and they all will understand clearly what it is all about.

JOURNALIST: Prime Minister Marape, you've noted that this treaty goes far beyond rugby league, for example, it's much bigger than that. But given you did get to see the Broncos win last night, do you feel a bit like Reece Walsh this morning? Like you've won a premiership in a diplomatic sense in this team work?

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Not so much. It's a work in progress for us. It's a work in progress. Reece Walsh will always come back next year to play again for Broncos. There's always next year to go, and these things are perpetual. NRL trophy lives on intergenerational. At the moment, you know, we work in this space. It will outlive me and my brother Anthony Albanese. It's a construct of our two people, two nation coexisting in this part of the world forever.

JOURNALIST: Mr. Marape, can you say how you'll allay the concerns in PNG about this treaty potentially dragging your country into a wider Pacific conflict if Australia were to join the US in any military action? And Prime Minister, can you give an update, Albanese, to the efforts to restore the Port of Darwin to Australian control?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Well, no, that's separate, I don't think that relates to this treaty so -

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Well on this, in this treaty, God forbid war. We in this construct, not for war, but for the construct of peace. And it is both in our everyday engagements and governments will come after us to make sure that the world we relate with, we advocate for peace in the first instance, in all instances. But as leaders, you have to be also thinking about the worst case scenario. Worst case scenarios takes place. You look at 1945. PNG was by the construct of our geography, unfortunately dragged into it. And so we just have to think the worst case scenario. But for us, in this instance, both of us, this is a construct of peace and not of war. I will be engaged - PNG's foreign, I think a friend asked earlier about our dominant foreign policy: friends to all, enemies to none. This one doesn't erode that dominant foreign policy. That foreign policy exists. So, just one aspect of foreign policy, the defence aspect is picked out and expanded in the scope. All the entire gamut of a foreign policy exists. We maintain friendships to all, enemies to none. We'll be advocates of peace in wherever we engage in, as far as our foreign relations concerned. I'm not, I'm 100 per cent certain Australia is not in the engagement of creating war every now and then. There's no war in the creation in our region. But we have many vulnerabilities. Our regional maritime spaces, our airspace, our land space, internal security conversations, people - I want to protect and promote more inter-people travel between PNG and Australia. I cannot do it when Australia feels that PNG is still insecure, unsafe. They don't know what's happening in PNG. So, there's a lot more transactional gain in this than just a military conversation. I will be an advocate of peace to those we relate with, that war is the last resort or not worth all going forward into the future.

JOURNALIST: Prime Minister Albanese, do you expect the defence agreement that you're currently negotiating with Fiji to include a similar mutual defence obligation to the PNG Treaty?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: I'm talking about the PNG relationship at this point in time. And can I conclude maybe this press conference by just saying that this is such an important day for both of our nations. And the relationship between our two peoples has so much history. As the Prime Minister has said, this is the only nation that you can swim to from Saibai Island. And that says something about geography as well. Can I also take the opportunity to thank the Prime Minister for his genuine friendship and warmth. We were the first Prime Ministers to walk, from either country, to walk as Prime Minister, the Kokoda Track. And some of you are still getting over that difficult few days. But it was absolutely wonderful to spend that time on Kokoda Track paying tribute to those who wore the Australian Defence Force uniform in our darkest hour and those from PNG who helped our people and defended, of course, what was their sovereignty at that time as well. One of the most memorable moments of my Prime Ministership will undoubtedly be waking up at the Isurava Memorial on Anzac Day. It's something that was a very humbling experience. To think of the hardship which people went through, under fire, in extraordinarily difficult terrain, in an environment that they could not possibly have anticipated, was one of the honours of my life. And I thank Prime Minister Marape for giving up, on his birthday as well, it must be said. And Rachel has almost, his wonderful wife has almost forgiven me for that. But it was a wonderful experience and I think it certainly cemented in a really concrete way just that we are mates, we are friends, we are neighbours, and today we're allies. And I thank the Prime Minister for that. And I'll give him the option now of departing.

PRIME MINISTER MARAPE: Thank you very much. So, the media, you've always been so kind. Please relay the positivity of these engagements. Australia-PNG military interoperability is just for the benefit of both side of the Torres Strait Island. This is the construct of it. Thank you.

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Thanks, Prime Minister.

JOURNALIST: Australia has shown itself willing to assist Australians who managed to smuggle themselves out of Syria, in issuing passports and assisting them to return back to the country. Why not heed the calls of the Kurds and the US to repatriate the remaining Australian citizens who remain in Syrian detention camps?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Australia did not provide assistance. The Australian citizens, of course, have the right to enter Australia. That's what occurred here.

JOURNALIST: Why don't we repatriate them?

JOURNALIST: Big telcos are all being summoned here tomorrow from Anika Wells. What's your message to those companies? Given we've seen failure after failure and deaths?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: That Optus failed its customers, failed its obligations, and needs to do better and we'll ensure that they do.

JOURNALIST: You talked a lot in the past couple of months about the rise of political violence, the threats against politicians. A Queensland man has now been charged with threatening to kill you. He made the threats on social media. Would you mind responding to those charges? And how do you reflect on this?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Thank you. We need to take these issues seriously and I thank the Australian Federal Police and the authorities for the work that they've done. This matter is before the courts now and the gentleman has been remanded and will appear before the courts on Wednesday. So, I won't go into any specifics because of that.

But these threats are real. We have seen in other countries, in the United States, in the United Kingdom, we have seen public figures, whether they be politicians or other public figures, targeted. I have consistently said we need to, wherever possible, turn down the temperature of debate and to agree and disagree respectfully, as much as possible. You know, we have a vibrant democracy here. No one's trying to stifle free speech. But the level of threats which have been made have been elevated substantially. It has meant changes to what I'm able to do and how I'm able to do it, and people will have seen that around. And I just say that for everyone, including in the media, but in politicians, we all have a responsibility as well. You know, turn down the temperature is really what we need to do. We're a great country and we need to show respect for each other. That doesn't mean agreement, but it does mean behaving in a way which is acceptable. And I'm concerned. ASIO Director-General has been very clear. Increasingly, the number of reports that I receive are substantial. It does mean, you know, even during the election campaign I like the idea that I can go get dog food for Toto at Woolworths here, and I like the idea that during the campaign I can walk through shopping centres and walk through malls and all of that. We don't want to lose that. It's a great thing about Australians and a great thing about our country, but there are alarms going and I think that we should all be conscious of it.

JOURNALIST: Just a question about the broader Pacific diplomacy. Crucial to that is the bid to host the COP Summit. One of the suggestions that's been floated to be able to break the impasse is splitting events between Australia and Turkey. Is there a risk in doing that if events are to be split, that you could I guess dilute or reduce the prominence of Pacific voices and in doing so I guess reduce one of the key reasons for hosting in the first place?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Look, the issue here is we have a bid with the Pacific. The issue here is if it's not resolved by consensus, there isn't a way to break the impasse. It reverts to Bonn. So, it's quite unusual there, the circumstances, they're not our rules. I'd be very happy to have had a vote, a deliberative decision making process at the United Nations or at COP. We'll continue to engage. That's what we're doing constructively.

JOURNALIST: Last week the Foreign Affairs Ministers suggested that concerns around sovereignty were still holding up the Nakamal Agreement, in particular the idea that Western nations could use those agreements to bully other Pacific nations. What do you make of those comments and are you still confident that agreement can get over the line?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: I'm confident. We're working through these issues but you know, some of the reporting on the issue that we just signed, for example, is just not accurate. We made it very clear that the only delay in PNG was the fact that it was the 50th anniversary and members of Cabinet went to their electorates to celebrate with their local communities who elect them to Parliament. And the declaration that myself and Prime Minister Marape signed in Port Moresby was very clear, was signed in front of his Defence Minister, his Foreign Minister and other senior members. I was very confident. If you read some of the front pages that were released after that, they just didn't reflect reality, in spite of the fact we were really transparent about it. And on that day we'd actually decided that this was the date when we would get it done, because Prime Minister Marape and I talked about, "oh well if we can't do it then", his processes, they're a sovereign nation that we respect. This was an appropriate day to do it here in Canberra. So, we'll work through these issues, but you know, we'll work through it constructively as we do respecting other nations as well.

JOURNALIST: Prime Minister, tomorrow, the October 7th anniversary, will the House be memorialising what events took place? And do you have any views on Larissa Waters' commentary yesterday effectively linking the attacks in Manchester to Australian antisemitism and the attacks in Israel?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: I thought that Senator Waters' comments were undignified, were not worthy of a Senator. I watched it on replay and was stunned. And I think that tomorrow is not a day, is not a day for demonstrations. I think that for people who engage and want to support or say they're supporting the Palestinian cause, it will not advance it. It will set it back in terms of support here in Australia. Tomorrow, October 7, it's the two year anniversary of the greatest number of murders of Jewish people since the Holocaust. That needs to be commemorated. I'll make a statement at the beginning of Question Time, and invite the Leader of the Opposition to do so as well. It will be a sombre day for Jewish Australians, but for Jewish people everywhere, but for people as well who just regard human rights and decent human behaviour. People were massacred who were attending young people attending a music festival. And terrorism needs to be opposed every time, unequivocally called out, that's what my Government will continue to do.

JOURNALIST: Mr Marape says that the treaty will open the way for some 10,000 Papua New Guineans to serve in the Australian Defence Force. Are you looking at numbers on that sort of scale?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: Certainly, in terms of over a period of time, it could be really substantial numbers. And of course those people will get skills that then - just like Australian Defence Force personnel. As you'll be aware, there'd be people here who've served in the Australian Defence Force. People certainly on my security team have. They go through, they learn skills, both physical skills and obviously skills related to defence and military activity, but they pick up other skills as well.

JOURNALIST: [INDISTINCT]

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: We will work all of those issues through, yes, over a period of time. And of course there are many people in the PNG Defence Force now who have been educated, who've been to Duntroon, who've participated as well. And that is a very positive thing.

JOURNALIST: Just a follow up, if I may. Do the remaining Australians in Syrian detention camps pose a national security threat to Australia?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: We deal with those issues. As I said, I responded to the question, which was that the reports - I made very clear that Australia wasn't providing assistance for those people to return to Australia. They, of course - Australian citizens are eligible to - obviously, Australian citizenship brings with it rights. I have confidence in our authorities and our agencies, our security agencies to undertake their work. And that's my position.

JOURNALIST: Thanks, Prime Minister. Just following up on Michael's question, now that PM Marape has gone. The Fiji treaty that's being discussed. It's very early. Would you contemplate some similarly sweeping provisions along the lines of what we're looking at today?

PRIME MINISTER ALBANESE: We'll work those issues through with my friend, Sitiveni Rabuka. The Fiji-Australia relationship is a very important one. The Defence Minister was there in Fiji just last week. We'll work those things through. What we do is we work these issues through diplomatically, with respect, and that's how we get results. And today we've got a cracker of a result. Thanks very much.